Battle area > Card Strategy
Butler Cat & Mega Flare
Sandy:
--- Quote from: Kazehi on May 19, 2014, 09:54:58 AM ---It's only considered a "OP" skill because people do not counter the clan directly. To stop the legion's full effectiveness, you simply nuke their field and attack hard enough to take away their hand. Stay on low damage and slam the field until the legion is left with 2-to pass- or take a hit when you can guard everything else. Like with all decks, theres a clear weakness, and once exploited even the mightiest deck falls flat on it's face.
Nova Grapplers have always been weak to retire based decks. Raizer can't generate a lot of advantage, but he can help speed things up. His goal is to swiftly deal the death blow. Your job is to smash rg's and up the damage count constantly forcing guards. It's a hard combo to break ,but I agree with Blaster than Sin Buster + support is much worse a scenario.
@ Tss: You could probably counter the deck using Murakumo based on Shirayuki , completely making the legion attack....guardable for 1 cb, or simply ignoring it, if you play correctly.
--- End quote ---
It kind of sucks though, that that's the only way to promptly stop them, nuke their field, how many clans/archetypes are capable of doing that reliably? Am I asking for the cat to be banned out right? No, am I asking it to at least be limited? Yes. Those decks that were in the recent Japanese tournament, ran three of the furballs and in a clan that restands like it's no one's business, I don't think they need a MUCH easier mechanic to do this. I keep on explaining to tss and nova, but as per usual, it's like hitting your head against a wall, nothing changes and you end up with a headache.
Lucius:
i think the only way to make the cat restricted is to make bushiroad notice that Card of being in too many decks in the next tournament
Sandy:
--- Quote from: lucius on May 19, 2014, 03:58:22 PM ---i think the only way to make the cat restricted is to make bushiroad notice that Card of being in too many decks in the next tournament
--- End quote ---
Weren't there 3 of them in 'every' NG deck in the Japanese tournament?
HunterSerge:
--- Quote from: Kazehi on May 19, 2014, 09:54:58 AM ---It's only considered a "OP" skill because people do not counter the clan directly. To stop the legion's full effectiveness, you simply nuke their field and attack hard enough to take away their hand. Stay on low damage and slam the field until the legion is left with 2-to pass- or take a hit when you can guard everything else. Like with all decks, theres a clear weakness, and once exploited even the mightiest deck falls flat on it's face.
Nova Grapplers have always been weak to retire based decks. Raizer can't generate a lot of advantage, but he can help speed things up. His goal is to swiftly deal the death blow. Your job is to smash rg's and up the damage count constantly forcing guards. It's a hard combo to break ,but I agree with Blaster than Sin Buster + support is much worse a scenario.
@ Tss: You could probably counter the deck using Murakumo based on Shirayuki , completely making the legion attack....guardable for 1 cb, or simply ignoring it, if you play correctly.
--- End quote ---
I hate seeing this sort of logic. If I have to run a specific deck just to stand a chance against this stuff...well, that's not exactly balanced, now is it? I primarily run Glendios. Raizers are a non-issue for me, because when I stop Mega Flare with Rubidium, Cat Butler can't trigger. Does that mean its not an issue? No, because its a 0 Counterblast, 0 Soulblast, -1 rearguard cost for a Vanguard restand, who will be swinging for 2-3 stages on their second swing. This is also fully active in midgame, because they have: A) An additional Critical to pressure you; B) An on-hit skill to stand one of their rearguards; and C) A Starter that grants ANOTHER on-hit skill to stand two of their rearguards for a measly -1. Not to mention that smart players won't even field Cat Butler if they can help it before their Legion is active. Keep in mind that just with the restand this is a +1. However, this is a minimum -4 to your opponent, because Mega Flare's inherent on-hit pressure makes your opponent guard the vanguard when its wiser to let it through during midgame, resulting in a -2. Then, they have to -2 AGAIN to guard the 2nd attack. So, overall, its generates a 5 card advantage gap.
Also, it should be noted that 4 Cat Butlers is easily workable. The Blau Ride Chain allows for it. BT04 Ride Chains increase your ride consistency significantly, since for the purposes of riding to Grade 3, you have 3 additional Grade 2s (only 3 because we need the G1 of the Ride Chain a turn early) that we can put ANYWHERE. 17-13-11-9 is the optimal ratio for riding up to Grade 3. So first we remove 3 from Grade 2 due to the Blau chain, slap them into Grade 0. For the last one, we just take it from Grade 3. People do this all the time, most decks take the standard ratio and move 1 card from 1 Grade and move it to another, usually from Grade 3 to Grade 1. Here, we're moving it from Grade 3 to grade 0. BUT WAIT. We don't even NEED to run 4 Cat Butler to get it super consistently, because Frozen Ogre is easily splashable and searches out the Cat whenever you need it. So yeah, any consistency argument is null and void.
''The Diablo'' Blaster:
--- Quote from: HunterSerge on May 20, 2014, 10:38:59 AM ---
--- Quote from: Kazehi on May 19, 2014, 09:54:58 AM ---It's only considered a "OP" skill because people do not counter the clan directly. To stop the legion's full effectiveness, you simply nuke their field and attack hard enough to take away their hand. Stay on low damage and slam the field until the legion is left with 2-to pass- or take a hit when you can guard everything else. Like with all decks, theres a clear weakness, and once exploited even the mightiest deck falls flat on it's face.
Nova Grapplers have always been weak to retire based decks. Raizer can't generate a lot of advantage, but he can help speed things up. His goal is to swiftly deal the death blow. Your job is to smash rg's and up the damage count constantly forcing guards. It's a hard combo to break ,but I agree with Blaster than Sin Buster + support is much worse a scenario.
@ Tss: You could probably counter the deck using Murakumo based on Shirayuki , completely making the legion attack....guardable for 1 cb, or simply ignoring it, if you play correctly.
--- End quote ---
I hate seeing this sort of logic. If I have to run a specific deck just to stand a chance against this stuff...well, that's not exactly balanced, now is it? I primarily run Glendios. Raizers are a non-issue for me, because when I stop Mega Flare with Rubidium, Cat Butler can't trigger. Does that mean its not an issue? No, because its a 0 Counterblast, 0 Soulblast, -1 rearguard cost for a Vanguard restand, who will be swinging for 2-3 stages on their second swing. This is also fully active in midgame, because they have: A) An additional Critical to pressure you; B) An on-hit skill to stand one of their rearguards; and C) A Starter that grants ANOTHER on-hit skill to stand two of their rearguards for a measly -1. Not to mention that smart players won't even field Cat Butler if they can help it before their Legion is active. Keep in mind that just with the restand this is a +1. However, this is a minimum -4 to your opponent, because Mega Flare's inherent on-hit pressure makes your opponent guard the vanguard when its wiser to let it through during midgame, resulting in a -2. Then, they have to -2 AGAIN to guard the 2nd attack. So, overall, its generates a 5 card advantage gap.
Also, it should be noted that 4 Cat Butlers is easily workable. The Blau Ride Chain allows for it. BT04 Ride Chains increase your ride consistency significantly, since for the purposes of riding to Grade 3, you have 3 additional Grade 2s (only 3 because we need the G1 of the Ride Chain a turn early) that we can put ANYWHERE. 17-13-11-9 is the optimal ratio for riding up to Grade 3. So first we remove 3 from Grade 2 due to the Blau chain, slap them into Grade 0. For the last one, we just take it from Grade 3. People do this all the time, most decks take the standard ratio and move 1 card from 1 Grade and move it to another, usually from Grade 3 to Grade 1. Here, we're moving it from Grade 3 to grade 0. BUT WAIT. We don't even NEED to run 4 Cat Butler to get it super consistently, because Frozen Ogre is easily splashable and searches out the Cat whenever you need it. So yeah, any consistency argument is null and void.
--- End quote ---
^I really have to agreee with that statement. Mega Flare with cat butler...as well as the whole thing with sin buster,daikaiser and laurel...both of those need a really big restriction, if not some kind of ban.
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