Area Forum
Cardfight!! Vanguard => Request => Topic started by: Sinon~ on March 29, 2015, 07:32:18 PM
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I had a discussion with Ren and others on forum chat about the use of the new Dimension Police Stand trigger skill.
(http://ust.chatango.com/um/r/e/ren9657/img/l_1334.jpg)
There was a big confusion because of a lack of highlighting the main part where the card has given its skill to the vanguard. As shown in the card text from this.
(http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20150312112853/cardfight/images/2/28/G-EB01-035.png)
Note the CFA text without highlights indicate that the player is allowed to place the stand trigger on top of the owners deck without shuffling. Then proceed into the battle phase where the vanguard is 37,000+ enabling them to draw the stand trigger that is placed on top of the deck and then shuffle before triple/twin drive.
This enables the user to re-use the card over and over because the actual CFA text was not highlighted which led into a major confusion and can be led into cheating.
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I do agree with this post. The only way you can tell the separation is by the Quotation Marks. But not many people can or will notice that.
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Yea this should be implied. since most of the newer Triggers with the "give skill to VG and then return to deck" would have the same prob.
This also applies to Enigman Sunset as well.
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Yeah, it's really important to highlight.... because much of the skills can be attractive...
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You're wrong. All abilities have different effects but lets look at some of them. Lets say Dimensional Robo, Daimagnum. According to your logic you can place this card into your soul if you have DP vanguard, but not give a power. It's wrong, you cannot. To understand why, you need to read the effect, when you can pay cost without making actual move. So lets say it's... Seeker, Light Saver Dragon. It's a grade 3 with and act legion skill. So it says: "[cb2] If this unit is in legion, choose up to 3 of your units, and they get power +5000..." - so in this case you can pay the cost without giving a power to anyone, cause it is stated in the ability. For deeper understanding there is another example of effect, when you can do one action, without doing another - Dragonic Burnout. I'm lazy writing it's effect, so if you're interested read it your self. The key words there is "you may". "You may" if my english is not bad enough, means that you're choosing to either perform action, or not. So in Dragonic Burnout case you may put an Overlord on bottom of your deck, and you may pay the cost after doing it.
So thats what I'm talking about. "May", "up to", and etc - are words that indicates choice, that player can make. You can read different card, and always, when you need to pay cost to activate something, Bushi are not forcing you to play the ability (if you find some, when you're forced to pay the cost if possible, show it to us ^^). In other cases like Pansy Musketeer, Silvia you're forced to use the ability - and if there is a Musketeer, you revealed, you must call it to rg circle.
So whats my point here? The point here is that in Operator Girl, Reika skill there is no any words like "may", or "up to" and once you activated the ability, you must resolve as much actions listed there as possible. Another example for ya, so you clearly understand what I'm speaking about - Brawler, Big Bang Knuckle Buster. As we already explored, once you paid the cost of it's legion skill there is no turn back, and you must resolve the skill, what was given to your vanguard - the multi-target attack. So there is interesting fact - when you're attacking if there is four targets - you must attack them all, cause it's stated in the ability (there is not "up to four", but just "four"). Though if you have less targets for an attack, you're attacking as much targets, as possible.
So you can place a draw trigger on top of your deck and not shuffle it only if you have no deck to shuffle or you have only 1 card in your deck, which is this draw trigger, that you just placed there. But it's the situation, when you lost already, so it's not possible.
I guess you just didnt understand this, thats why you posted this thread. Also, people who dont know rules nor they have read the Comprehensive Rules should read them, or not being surprized, when on tournaments their opponent, who red those, will notice his mistake. As for casual games - players either will get fun from the game anyway or will learn on their own mistakes - and wont make them again.
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i have checked the card on area and the wiki and expy is right. if you paid the cost you have no choice but to give the power, draw if it hits and you have the power to draw and shuffle. you have no choice but to do these acts since there is no you may or you can.
i believe this is just a missunderstanding from who ever read it and i do believe this is pretty much resolved unless there is a card out there with this problem.
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Erm.
Cards skills like the stand trigger as I have posted isn't a case of "you may" or not.
You place the card on top of the deck. Then you give the vanguard a new skill then you shuffle.
People are reading it as that you shuffle when you use the vanguard skill.
This is nothing about the case of you may pay the cost or not.
You activate the skill. You have to fulfill it all.
EDIT : Its a case of people not reading the highlighted section and assume that you can re-use the stand trigger skill over and over by drawing it.
People are that simple on area.
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i have checked the card on area and the wiki and expy is right. if you paid the cost you have no choice but to give the power, draw if it hits and shuffle. you have no choice but to do these acts since there is no you may or you can.
i believe this is just a missunderstanding from who ever read it and i do believe this is pretty much resolved unless there is a card out there with this problem.
No no no no.
1. You draw when your vanguard attacks at 37k
2. You are meant to shuffle after you give the vanguard the skill.
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The point of this thread was missed horribly and I don't know why it was locked.
I'm unlocking it so it can be better explained for why this is very much needed.
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after speaking to magus it seems some players ignore the red highlighted words or something allong the line.
i myself do not know how people can missunderstand the skill if they read it but if there is a way to bring less missunderstanding i say highlight em.
i dont understand the problem well myself but i hope someone who is reading this will have a better ability to explain it.
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The text we have right now in area does not highlight the red text on cards very well. It is currently highlighted with quotation marks.
[ACT](RC) Generation Break 1 (This ability is active if you have one or more face up G units in total on your (VC) or G zone):[Put this unit on top of your deck] Choose one of your vanguards, until end of turn, it gets [Power]+4000 and "[AUTO](VC):When this unit attacks a vanguard, if this unit's [Power] is 37000 or greater, draw a card.", and shuffle your deck.
This is how it's worded in area right now with no difference in color to the text. The only thing that shows the separation of the text is those quotation marks which is easily being confused as part of the red text of the card which it is not.
Basicly the point of this thread is: We want a way to see the red text of cards easier in Cardfight Area so that players do not get easily confused.
Also while off-topic I wish to clear up confusion on how this card actually works, This is the wording on the card with the color.
[ACT](RC) Generation Break 1 (This ability is active if you have one or more face up G units in total on your (VC) or G zone):[Put this unit on top of your deck] Choose one of your vanguards, until end of turn, it gets [Power]+4000 and "[AUTO](VC):When this unit attacks a vanguard, if this unit's [Power] is 37000 or greater, draw a card.", and shuffle your deck.
The order is as follows
1. (This is a ACT ablity card so we are in Main Phase) Declare this unit skill and Pay Cost
2. Choose Vanguard and give it +4000 power as well as it also gains the skill text highlighted in red till end of the turn.
3. Shuffle your deck.
4. Skill Ends. Main phase continues normally.
And that's it after that the text in red remains waiting on the vanguard. So whenever you attack the vanguard if you meet all the requirements you will get to draw 1 card.
Anyway that's it. I hope I gave a clear understanding to what the original post was trying to say as well as hopefully lifted any confusion on how this card works. I hope that a fix can be done for all cards that include red text in it and not just this one.
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thank you magus that was a much better explanation. i guess the "" and the comas arnt enough for some people so i guess its best we get highlights.
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Magus TSS, well, if you wanted to make those kind of skills become red - I transfered it to admins. It's funny though, that nobody had this problem before TS.
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Magus TSS, well, if you wanted to make those kind of skills become red - I transfered it to admins. It's funny though, that nobody had this problem before TS.
when i person desires only victory they do anything for it....aka cheat.
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when i person desires only victory they do anything for it....aka cheat.
learn rules and you'll be fine. In other case - dont complain. It's simple.